<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Omnicom Group&#8217;s Bad Terms For Photographers And Producers</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/</link>
	<description>Former Photography Director Rob Haggart</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:35:52 -0500</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Piero Frescobaldi</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-53671</link>
		<dc:creator>Piero Frescobaldi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 14:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-53671</guid>
		<description>Hello All,  

I think this is an OPPORTUNITY.  Let me explain.

I run a Digital prod company working internationally, among which with omnicom companies.  

Omnicom has and is still trying to pass this to its digital vendors as well.  It is good to know that so far most of the big player are refusing such terms.  It is good to know that they tried it with TV production companies a while back, but failed as no one wanted to work with them.

I do agree that this moves goes a long way to question the role of Ad agencies.  An essential role for the industry for so many years.  A role that currently they seem unsure to hold.  This policy is being crafted by someone who has little connection with the world of specialised services. True.  But who cares?

It is not the end of the world. If you look at this positively, it is an opportunity.  A real opportunity to be paid in time.  An opportunity to be paid upfront and on delivery.   Enough of chasing money after the project.  Enough of 30 or 60 or 90 days.  etc.  

Omnicom wants to relinquish responsibility?  Fine.  Pay an advance and pay on delivery. 

If they don&#039;t then there is an opportunity to go to brands direct and offer them an agency that will take that responsibility and service.  

By doing this Omnicom is creating opportunity for all.

Onwards and upwards!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello All,  </p>
<p>I think this is an OPPORTUNITY.  Let me explain.</p>
<p>I run a Digital prod company working internationally, among which with omnicom companies.  </p>
<p>Omnicom has and is still trying to pass this to its digital vendors as well.  It is good to know that so far most of the big player are refusing such terms.  It is good to know that they tried it with TV production companies a while back, but failed as no one wanted to work with them.</p>
<p>I do agree that this moves goes a long way to question the role of Ad agencies.  An essential role for the industry for so many years.  A role that currently they seem unsure to hold.  This policy is being crafted by someone who has little connection with the world of specialised services. True.  But who cares?</p>
<p>It is not the end of the world. If you look at this positively, it is an opportunity.  A real opportunity to be paid in time.  An opportunity to be paid upfront and on delivery.   Enough of chasing money after the project.  Enough of 30 or 60 or 90 days.  etc.  </p>
<p>Omnicom wants to relinquish responsibility?  Fine.  Pay an advance and pay on delivery. </p>
<p>If they don&#8217;t then there is an opportunity to go to brands direct and offer them an agency that will take that responsibility and service.  </p>
<p>By doing this Omnicom is creating opportunity for all.</p>
<p>Onwards and upwards!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Erica Chadwick</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40934</link>
		<dc:creator>Erica Chadwick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40934</guid>
		<description>After getting job requests for my photographers from Omnicom companies since this announcement, myself and other photo agents have found that many of the agencies under the Omnicom umbrella interpret these new terms differently.   Some will still provide advances.  Sometimes the advance will be promised, but it will be late.  Some agencies are even saying that nothing has changed, and they haven&#039;t even been told to change their practices.

If you get a call from Omnicom, the best thing to do is ask a lot of questions before you estimate the job.  Make sure they will provide an advance.  Make sure your terms and conditions state that photographs will not be delivered until an advance is received.  

Make sure your invoices state that images may not be used until you are paid in full.  This is to avoid copyright infringement and protect the agency and their clients.

While I have not worked with an Onmicom company since this announcement, it is worth noting that several other agencies I have gotten POs from have changes the wording on their POs to include the &quot;acting as agent for&quot; clause, and sequential liability.  We were not warned of the new terms before we received the PO, and the art buyers also did not know that there were new terms in the POs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After getting job requests for my photographers from Omnicom companies since this announcement, myself and other photo agents have found that many of the agencies under the Omnicom umbrella interpret these new terms differently.   Some will still provide advances.  Sometimes the advance will be promised, but it will be late.  Some agencies are even saying that nothing has changed, and they haven&#8217;t even been told to change their practices.</p>
<p>If you get a call from Omnicom, the best thing to do is ask a lot of questions before you estimate the job.  Make sure they will provide an advance.  Make sure your terms and conditions state that photographs will not be delivered until an advance is received.  </p>
<p>Make sure your invoices state that images may not be used until you are paid in full.  This is to avoid copyright infringement and protect the agency and their clients.</p>
<p>While I have not worked with an Onmicom company since this announcement, it is worth noting that several other agencies I have gotten POs from have changes the wording on their POs to include the &#8220;acting as agent for&#8221; clause, and sequential liability.  We were not warned of the new terms before we received the PO, and the art buyers also did not know that there were new terms in the POs.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bruce DeBoer</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40575</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce DeBoer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Mar 2009 02:10:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40575</guid>
		<description>@9  

Andy is exactly right.   If this year hasn&#039;t taught photographers to take contracts seriously, nothing will.  If Omnicom is protecting themselves from their clients, shouldn&#039;t us relatively small fish do the same?  Jeeeeezz. 

Thanks for the heads up Rob.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@9  </p>
<p>Andy is exactly right.   If this year hasn&#8217;t taught photographers to take contracts seriously, nothing will.  If Omnicom is protecting themselves from their clients, shouldn&#8217;t us relatively small fish do the same?  Jeeeeezz. </p>
<p>Thanks for the heads up Rob.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Gordon Moat</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40495</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordon Moat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Mar 2009 02:00:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40495</guid>
		<description>Maybe we can get AIG to write PDS (Photography Default Swaps) for this. I read about the Omnicom issue through financial news on my investment account, and then decided to check here. No surprise to see it become a hot issue very quickly. Omnicom Group can issue bonds to fund future business, but I would bet that no photographers can do that.

I have worked mostly corporate direct, and I am still new in photography. While I have been trying to line up more agency work, I have to wonder if I can afford the risk. If Omnicom succeeds in making this work, then it will entice other agencies to follow their lead. Currently the pace of deadlines and the use of in-house creatives already limit the usage of photographer through some agencies. I don&#039;t think everything can fit into a draw or illustrated pattern, so at some point the agencies will need photography.

Maybe its time to go back to the model that Magnum created, but with a twist. I really think ASMP, EP, and APA have been in-effective, largely because they do not speak with a unified voice. Sure, there is a one-for-all mentality of competitiveness, but I think a collective with some bargaining power would be a good thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe we can get AIG to write PDS (Photography Default Swaps) for this. I read about the Omnicom issue through financial news on my investment account, and then decided to check here. No surprise to see it become a hot issue very quickly. Omnicom Group can issue bonds to fund future business, but I would bet that no photographers can do that.</p>
<p>I have worked mostly corporate direct, and I am still new in photography. While I have been trying to line up more agency work, I have to wonder if I can afford the risk. If Omnicom succeeds in making this work, then it will entice other agencies to follow their lead. Currently the pace of deadlines and the use of in-house creatives already limit the usage of photographer through some agencies. I don&#8217;t think everything can fit into a draw or illustrated pattern, so at some point the agencies will need photography.</p>
<p>Maybe its time to go back to the model that Magnum created, but with a twist. I really think ASMP, EP, and APA have been in-effective, largely because they do not speak with a unified voice. Sure, there is a one-for-all mentality of competitiveness, but I think a collective with some bargaining power would be a good thing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: A Photo Editor?</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40487</link>
		<dc:creator>A Photo Editor?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 21:20:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40487</guid>
		<description>[...] http://www.aphotoeditor.com (full link) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div style="padding: 1em; background-color: #FFF8DC">[...] <a href="http://www.aphotoeditor.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.aphotoeditor.com</a> (full link) [...]</div>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40482</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 19:58:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40482</guid>
		<description>Great stuff dude... I just revised my terms slightly using a few of your suggestions: 

&quot;This Agreement supersedes any and all prior representations and agreements, past and future, whether written or verbal. Neither Photographer nor Licensee shall be bound by any purchase order, term, condition, representation, warranty or provision other than specifically stated in this Agreement.&quot;

My agreement also defines Licensee as the Agency....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great stuff dude&#8230; I just revised my terms slightly using a few of your suggestions: </p>
<p>&#8220;This Agreement supersedes any and all prior representations and agreements, past and future, whether written or verbal. Neither Photographer nor Licensee shall be bound by any purchase order, term, condition, representation, warranty or provision other than specifically stated in this Agreement.&#8221;</p>
<p>My agreement also defines Licensee as the Agency&#8230;.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: dude</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40474</link>
		<dc:creator>dude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 19:21:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40474</guid>
		<description>This is ridiculous.  One way to add teeth to the ASMP&#039;s advice would be to specify that your work is being licensed to the AGENCY for creation of derivative works and the license is transferred upon receipt in full of payment.  

On any estimate forms or other paperwork submitted, specify &quot;this agreement shall supercede any other agreements, past and future, made between ______ &#039;the Agency&#039; and ______ &#039;the Photographer&#039;.&quot;  ...and make sure you get an original SIGNED by an art buyer (not a freelancer) employed by the agency.  And also get the countersigned contract from the agency before beginning any work.

Or better yet, specify &quot;as per the agreement signed ____ (date of activation of the agency contract), this agreement shall supercede...&quot; blah blah blah.

Maybe also throw in small print specifying that all parties agree the agreement is between the AGENCY and the photographer or something to specify the relationship (the &quot;agency&quot; is not really an &quot;agency&quot; then, is it?  Rather it&#039;s an company which is in the business of creating derivative works from subcontractors&#039; original, copyright-protected works).

I would hope that, given two conflicting contracts, one of which specifies supercedence of other agreements,  most judges would favor the little guy.  It at least gives you more recourse and explicitly defines the agreement terms and relationship.  I would think that any photographers who get shafted would be able to show plenty of precedence (aka: past jobs) and &quot;industry standards&quot; (aka: jobs completed with other agencies).

However, I&#039;m not a lawyer, so would any lawyers reading this blog care to comment?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is ridiculous.  One way to add teeth to the ASMP&#8217;s advice would be to specify that your work is being licensed to the AGENCY for creation of derivative works and the license is transferred upon receipt in full of payment.  </p>
<p>On any estimate forms or other paperwork submitted, specify &#8220;this agreement shall supercede any other agreements, past and future, made between ______ &#8216;the Agency&#8217; and ______ &#8216;the Photographer&#8217;.&#8221;  &#8230;and make sure you get an original SIGNED by an art buyer (not a freelancer) employed by the agency.  And also get the countersigned contract from the agency before beginning any work.</p>
<p>Or better yet, specify &#8220;as per the agreement signed ____ (date of activation of the agency contract), this agreement shall supercede&#8230;&#8221; blah blah blah.</p>
<p>Maybe also throw in small print specifying that all parties agree the agreement is between the AGENCY and the photographer or something to specify the relationship (the &#8220;agency&#8221; is not really an &#8220;agency&#8221; then, is it?  Rather it&#8217;s an company which is in the business of creating derivative works from subcontractors&#8217; original, copyright-protected works).</p>
<p>I would hope that, given two conflicting contracts, one of which specifies supercedence of other agreements,  most judges would favor the little guy.  It at least gives you more recourse and explicitly defines the agreement terms and relationship.  I would think that any photographers who get shafted would be able to show plenty of precedence (aka: past jobs) and &#8220;industry standards&#8221; (aka: jobs completed with other agencies).</p>
<p>However, I&#8217;m not a lawyer, so would any lawyers reading this blog care to comment?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: michael ash</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40473</link>
		<dc:creator>michael ash</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 18:56:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40473</guid>
		<description>@Anthony, and EVERYONE else

PLEASE JUST SAY NO .......NO NO period</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Anthony, and EVERYONE else</p>
<p>PLEASE JUST SAY NO &#8230;&#8230;.NO NO period</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40472</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 18:46:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40472</guid>
		<description>if you hire ME, you pay ME - I don&#039;t give a shit about whether someone pays you or not because that is not my business - again if you hire ME you pay ME and if you put a bogus contract in my face I will rewrite it and send it back.  

Do they think my assistant would be ok spending 10 hours with me and me saying oh yeah the client never paid me so I&#039;m not paying you for your hard work...sawrey.

Photographers have no place in being banks or whores PERIOD.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>if you hire ME, you pay ME &#8211; I don&#8217;t give a shit about whether someone pays you or not because that is not my business &#8211; again if you hire ME you pay ME and if you put a bogus contract in my face I will rewrite it and send it back.  </p>
<p>Do they think my assistant would be ok spending 10 hours with me and me saying oh yeah the client never paid me so I&#8217;m not paying you for your hard work&#8230;sawrey.</p>
<p>Photographers have no place in being banks or whores PERIOD.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40468</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 15:51:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40468</guid>
		<description>A few years back photogs took on business week and where able to get that contract altered and day rates raised. If I remember correctly it involved freelancers and staff photogs.  Eventually we just have to just put our collective feet down and tell these big corps to F off.  Just say NO to these bastards. I&#039;ve been shooting on my own for 6 years and assisted for 6 years before that, I&#039;ve managed to stay debt free and pay the mortgage and have two kids with health insurance . . . Contracts like this make me want to throw in the towel on commercial shooting.  People complain about bridezillas and weddings being a pain, but to be honest the last couple years I make more per job on weddings than on commercial jobs.  Plus I write the contact and can choose who&#039;s wedding to shoot.  Dealing with these big companies and there contracts gets less appealing ever day, sure I might miss seeing my work in print, but I&#039;d probably get over it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few years back photogs took on business week and where able to get that contract altered and day rates raised. If I remember correctly it involved freelancers and staff photogs.  Eventually we just have to just put our collective feet down and tell these big corps to F off.  Just say NO to these bastards. I&#8217;ve been shooting on my own for 6 years and assisted for 6 years before that, I&#8217;ve managed to stay debt free and pay the mortgage and have two kids with health insurance . . . Contracts like this make me want to throw in the towel on commercial shooting.  People complain about bridezillas and weddings being a pain, but to be honest the last couple years I make more per job on weddings than on commercial jobs.  Plus I write the contact and can choose who&#8217;s wedding to shoot.  Dealing with these big companies and there contracts gets less appealing ever day, sure I might miss seeing my work in print, but I&#8217;d probably get over it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ad photographer</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40467</link>
		<dc:creator>ad photographer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 14:45:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40467</guid>
		<description>@KB SUAREZ, 

Mr. Suarez:

Then do it. You are now elected president of the group that will unite APA and ASMP -- these are your marching orders -- go do it.

You are that man. We elect you. Make it happen.

Any time I hear a politican say, &quot;We need to fix Social Security; we need to fix Medicare; we need to fix health care&quot;, I just tune it out, because it&#039;s clear they have no answer, and are just pandering to the masses.

&quot;We need; we need&quot;. Of course, we need, but photographers are a desperate bunch, when push comes to shove. Rent comes due, and the ethics go right out the window. We have no one to blame but ourselves.

Talk is cheap. Go fix it. I dare you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@KB SUAREZ, </p>
<p>Mr. Suarez:</p>
<p>Then do it. You are now elected president of the group that will unite APA and ASMP &#8212; these are your marching orders &#8212; go do it.</p>
<p>You are that man. We elect you. Make it happen.</p>
<p>Any time I hear a politican say, &#8220;We need to fix Social Security; we need to fix Medicare; we need to fix health care&#8221;, I just tune it out, because it&#8217;s clear they have no answer, and are just pandering to the masses.</p>
<p>&#8220;We need; we need&#8221;. Of course, we need, but photographers are a desperate bunch, when push comes to shove. Rent comes due, and the ethics go right out the window. We have no one to blame but ourselves.</p>
<p>Talk is cheap. Go fix it. I dare you.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: KB SUAREZ</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40465</link>
		<dc:creator>KB SUAREZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 14:37:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40465</guid>
		<description>Why cant it work like Directors, Why cant we Unionize, Unions work in every aspect of film, and it works. why cant Photo follow film and Unionize?

Every Man for himself, is why we are having this discussion and these problems, we dont respect ourselves, so our clients dont respect us.

I would love the large inflatable Rat in front of any advertising firm, Conde Nast building, anywhere in NY protesting. 

If we dont stand as one, we fall apart as many.

ASMP/APA need to join together.
and
Photography needs a larger voice in the industry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why cant it work like Directors, Why cant we Unionize, Unions work in every aspect of film, and it works. why cant Photo follow film and Unionize?</p>
<p>Every Man for himself, is why we are having this discussion and these problems, we dont respect ourselves, so our clients dont respect us.</p>
<p>I would love the large inflatable Rat in front of any advertising firm, Conde Nast building, anywhere in NY protesting. </p>
<p>If we dont stand as one, we fall apart as many.</p>
<p>ASMP/APA need to join together.<br />
and<br />
Photography needs a larger voice in the industry.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Krig om fotografer: ingen forh&#229;nd, ingen tilbagetog. Bare holde shooting . &#171; fandenivold</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40463</link>
		<dc:creator>Krig om fotografer: ingen forh&#229;nd, ingen tilbagetog. Bare holde shooting . &#171; fandenivold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 12:57:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40463</guid>
		<description>[...] Reklamer er  ned . Og for at g&#248;re tingene v&#230;rre, i denne uge store virksomheder gerne  Omnicom  og  GM  flyttet den finansielle byrde for kunstneren. Nogle siger,  produktion forsikring , der [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div style="padding: 1em; background-color: #FFF8DC">[...] Reklamer er  ned . Og for at g&oslash;re tingene v&aelig;rre, i denne uge store virksomheder gerne  Omnicom  og  GM  flyttet den finansielle byrde for kunstneren. Nogle siger,  produktion forsikring , der [...]</div>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: day19</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40439</link>
		<dc:creator>day19</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 03:49:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40439</guid>
		<description>@Kenneth, $2-$10,000.  Last summer we had to pay $36,000 for last minute flights to the other side of the world for us and our crew before the advance came in.  Luckily the advance came quickly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Kenneth, $2-$10,000.  Last summer we had to pay $36,000 for last minute flights to the other side of the world for us and our crew before the advance came in.  Luckily the advance came quickly.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bruce DeBoer</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40437</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce DeBoer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 01:28:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40437</guid>
		<description>Sounds as if the contract with Omnicom is worthless; A contract with their client is now necessary with these changes.  Or .... 100% down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sounds as if the contract with Omnicom is worthless; A contract with their client is now necessary with these changes.  Or &#8230;. 100% down.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrea LaBarge Mills</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40428</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrea LaBarge Mills</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 23:22:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40428</guid>
		<description>@Terry Divyak, 

that was my thought exactly! As an emerging photographer still trying to pay off my education, I should be looking to jobs to help me accomplish that, not be forced to choose between making a loan payment this month or putting it off to help finance a job instead. (which I know would be a dumb thing to do)

Thankfully, being new to the scene it will be a while before I&#039;m being considered for those big-budget gigs. I can only hope it gets better and not worse between now and whenever I get there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Terry Divyak, </p>
<p>that was my thought exactly! As an emerging photographer still trying to pay off my education, I should be looking to jobs to help me accomplish that, not be forced to choose between making a loan payment this month or putting it off to help finance a job instead. (which I know would be a dumb thing to do)</p>
<p>Thankfully, being new to the scene it will be a while before I&#8217;m being considered for those big-budget gigs. I can only hope it gets better and not worse between now and whenever I get there.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ad photographer</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40427</link>
		<dc:creator>ad photographer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 22:20:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40427</guid>
		<description>@doktor, @Anthony:

It can be very simple. No lawsuit or countersuit is necessary. You just say no and move on. No advance, no scouting. No advance, no casting.

Again, photographers cannot unionize. They are freelancers. Only employees can unionize. Hell, take three photographers, put them in a room, ask them where they want to eat dinner, and within ten minutes, it&#039;s a huge argument, a fight breaks out, and the cops are called. So nobody get their hopes up about ANY kind of solidarity. It&#039;s every man for himself in Photographer World. Always has been, always will be.

And please, let&#039;s put the term Day Rate to bed forever, can we? It&#039;s 2009.

And clients NEVER cared about the interests of the photographer. This is business; not a campfire. Do you care about the interests of the ad agency or the client? No, you just want to shoot a nice image, and get paid. End of story. So turnabout is fair play.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@doktor, @Anthony:</p>
<p>It can be very simple. No lawsuit or countersuit is necessary. You just say no and move on. No advance, no scouting. No advance, no casting.</p>
<p>Again, photographers cannot unionize. They are freelancers. Only employees can unionize. Hell, take three photographers, put them in a room, ask them where they want to eat dinner, and within ten minutes, it&#8217;s a huge argument, a fight breaks out, and the cops are called. So nobody get their hopes up about ANY kind of solidarity. It&#8217;s every man for himself in Photographer World. Always has been, always will be.</p>
<p>And please, let&#8217;s put the term Day Rate to bed forever, can we? It&#8217;s 2009.</p>
<p>And clients NEVER cared about the interests of the photographer. This is business; not a campfire. Do you care about the interests of the ad agency or the client? No, you just want to shoot a nice image, and get paid. End of story. So turnabout is fair play.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: doktor</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40426</link>
		<dc:creator>doktor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 21:57:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40426</guid>
		<description>were&#039;s the photographers strike? Well photographers are not unionized so nobody can afford it and it prob can&#039;t be organized. It&#039;s a a nice idea though - several months without photography. Lets see if they can get it from flickr. Would have to get Getty and Corbis on board too though (which will never happen - the days that they cared about the interest of the photographers are long gone)

Anyway I don&#039;t like the idea of dealing with the client directly too much. I have done it before - sometimes they have no understanding of the photographers jobs, life, career and risks (they see your day rate and think photographers are payed way too much etc). At the agencies they know at least a little about you and your risks etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>were&#8217;s the photographers strike? Well photographers are not unionized so nobody can afford it and it prob can&#8217;t be organized. It&#8217;s a a nice idea though &#8211; several months without photography. Lets see if they can get it from flickr. Would have to get Getty and Corbis on board too though (which will never happen &#8211; the days that they cared about the interest of the photographers are long gone)</p>
<p>Anyway I don&#8217;t like the idea of dealing with the client directly too much. I have done it before &#8211; sometimes they have no understanding of the photographers jobs, life, career and risks (they see your day rate and think photographers are payed way too much etc). At the agencies they know at least a little about you and your risks etc.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: dude</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40425</link>
		<dc:creator>dude</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 21:37:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40425</guid>
		<description>@Simon Crofts, 
More confusingly, what about when the agency has a massive account like GM which has already paid a retainer and/or has receivables coming and going like a revolving door.  Often it&#039;s run more like a tab, rather than discrete invoices being paid for specific jobs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Simon Crofts,<br />
More confusingly, what about when the agency has a massive account like GM which has already paid a retainer and/or has receivables coming and going like a revolving door.  Often it&#8217;s run more like a tab, rather than discrete invoices being paid for specific jobs.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Terry Divyak</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40424</link>
		<dc:creator>Terry Divyak</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 21:18:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40424</guid>
		<description>So what happens if the ad agency gets in a pissing match with their clients due to some dispute unrelated  to the photographer? The photographer doesn&#039;t get paid because of the politics of the situation? 

Is the photographer allowed to know the credit worthiness of the client? Who are they? can they even pay? 

How will TARP, TALF and the political winds effect their ability to pay? 

All this seems to end badly for those who want to be full time photographers with student loans to pay.

http://www.universities.com/edu/Brooks_Institute.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So what happens if the ad agency gets in a pissing match with their clients due to some dispute unrelated  to the photographer? The photographer doesn&#8217;t get paid because of the politics of the situation? </p>
<p>Is the photographer allowed to know the credit worthiness of the client? Who are they? can they even pay? </p>
<p>How will TARP, TALF and the political winds effect their ability to pay? </p>
<p>All this seems to end badly for those who want to be full time photographers with student loans to pay.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.universities.com/edu/Brooks_Institute.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.universities.com/edu/Brooks_Institute.html</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: A Photo Editor - Omnicom Group’s Bad Terms For Photographers And Producers &#124; The Click</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40423</link>
		<dc:creator>A Photo Editor - Omnicom Group’s Bad Terms For Photographers And Producers &#124; The Click</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 20:26:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40423</guid>
		<description>[...] Check it out here. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div style="padding: 1em; background-color: #FFF8DC">[...] Check it out here. [...]</div>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: d</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40412</link>
		<dc:creator>d</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 19:46:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40412</guid>
		<description>@Nick, 

&quot;maintaining solidarity&quot; I am afraid it won&#039;t happen...
I actually nether saw such thing... that mean before maintaining is bringing...

But you&#039;re right otherwise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Nick, </p>
<p>&#8220;maintaining solidarity&#8221; I am afraid it won&#8217;t happen&#8230;<br />
I actually nether saw such thing&#8230; that mean before maintaining is bringing&#8230;</p>
<p>But you&#8217;re right otherwise.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: A Photo Editor</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40402</link>
		<dc:creator>A Photo Editor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 17:54:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40402</guid>
		<description>@ad photographer, 
point #5- yes there is a reason why art buyers talk about working photographers/agents with production experience and it&#039;s not just about barking orders on set.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ad photographer,<br />
point #5- yes there is a reason why art buyers talk about working photographers/agents with production experience and it&#8217;s not just about barking orders on set.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anthony</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40401</link>
		<dc:creator>Anthony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 17:48:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40401</guid>
		<description>I think the solution to this issue will just have to be a counter suit type terms on our side wherein photographers demand payment in full prior to SHOOTING the job. Agreed upon estimate, shots, usage...hand over the check and we&#039;ll get started.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the solution to this issue will just have to be a counter suit type terms on our side wherein photographers demand payment in full prior to SHOOTING the job. Agreed upon estimate, shots, usage&#8230;hand over the check and we&#8217;ll get started.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: No Name #1</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40400</link>
		<dc:creator>No Name #1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 17:32:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40400</guid>
		<description>@Kenneth, 

ASMP is known for jumping the gun and claiming credit for all sorts of actions.

Are you so sure APA is not working behind the scenes?


Just because you are the first to crow about it does not make you the biggest rooster in the yard.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Kenneth, </p>
<p>ASMP is known for jumping the gun and claiming credit for all sorts of actions.</p>
<p>Are you so sure APA is not working behind the scenes?</p>
<p>Just because you are the first to crow about it does not make you the biggest rooster in the yard.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Steven Rood</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40399</link>
		<dc:creator>Steven Rood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 17:19:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40399</guid>
		<description>What makes this all the more insane is when you start to think about how many ad agencies are under the Omnicom umbrella. Rise up people and don&#039;t take this crap. When art buyers can&#039;t get photographers to shoot, this will in turn get the creatives up in arms and the machine will grind to a halt. Or everyone will just use stock and say fuck it. I pray for the former.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What makes this all the more insane is when you start to think about how many ad agencies are under the Omnicom umbrella. Rise up people and don&#8217;t take this crap. When art buyers can&#8217;t get photographers to shoot, this will in turn get the creatives up in arms and the machine will grind to a halt. Or everyone will just use stock and say fuck it. I pray for the former.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nick</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40398</link>
		<dc:creator>Nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 17:13:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40398</guid>
		<description>This is definitely going to become an issue not entirely exclusive to Omnicom as soon as other holding company CFOs decide further tightening the purse strings can decrease the amount of debt in their books. 

Here&#039;s a piece I wrote about the issue when the film producers started to get up in arms about it a few weeks ago: http://tinyurl.com/dlmu4x

Funnily enough, I&#039;d just finished a piece on what Argentine creatives did and noticed as their economy slowed down a decade ago; a quote that stuck with me was this: &quot;one thing I remember was the sudden all-powerful and in full metal jacket appearance of CFOs and other financial managers, messing even with the creative product itself, in some cases deciding over who should stay or go in creative departments. That was a moment when I said &quot;oh dear, the boat is sinking.&quot; (that&#039;s here, btw: http://tinyurl.com/bug3tj)

Generally I wouldn&#039;t flog my own work this way but these two stories are pretty germane to the discussion; I&#039;m glad people in the photo community are starting to take notice; the next step is to stand together and voice dissent and not take the jobs. the problem there is maintaining solidarity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is definitely going to become an issue not entirely exclusive to Omnicom as soon as other holding company CFOs decide further tightening the purse strings can decrease the amount of debt in their books. </p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a piece I wrote about the issue when the film producers started to get up in arms about it a few weeks ago: <a href="http://tinyurl.com/dlmu4x" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/dlmu4x</a></p>
<p>Funnily enough, I&#8217;d just finished a piece on what Argentine creatives did and noticed as their economy slowed down a decade ago; a quote that stuck with me was this: &#8220;one thing I remember was the sudden all-powerful and in full metal jacket appearance of CFOs and other financial managers, messing even with the creative product itself, in some cases deciding over who should stay or go in creative departments. That was a moment when I said &#8220;oh dear, the boat is sinking.&#8221; (that&#8217;s here, btw: <a href="http://tinyurl.com/bug3tj)" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/bug3tj)</a></p>
<p>Generally I wouldn&#8217;t flog my own work this way but these two stories are pretty germane to the discussion; I&#8217;m glad people in the photo community are starting to take notice; the next step is to stand together and voice dissent and not take the jobs. the problem there is maintaining solidarity.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ad photographer</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40397</link>
		<dc:creator>ad photographer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 16:54:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40397</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s the link to PDN story. 

http://tinyurl.com/dkuaxh

And I spoke with a friend of mine, a car shooter in Detroit, recently, and he says this is just the tip of the iceberg. The details are not encouraging.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s the link to PDN story. </p>
<p><a href="http://tinyurl.com/dkuaxh" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/dkuaxh</a></p>
<p>And I spoke with a friend of mine, a car shooter in Detroit, recently, and he says this is just the tip of the iceberg. The details are not encouraging.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: myles</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40396</link>
		<dc:creator>myles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 16:50:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40396</guid>
		<description>@Carl Corey, While I love this idea the one thing that freelancers do not hold over the giants is bulk buying. You can bet Omincom gets better media rates than joe freelancer would. Though you do raise a good point - saving the 17.5 % - would that be enough to level the playing field. Maybe not quite but close. Time to shake the model.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Carl Corey, While I love this idea the one thing that freelancers do not hold over the giants is bulk buying. You can bet Omincom gets better media rates than joe freelancer would. Though you do raise a good point &#8211; saving the 17.5 % &#8211; would that be enough to level the playing field. Maybe not quite but close. Time to shake the model.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: andy anderson</title>
		<link>http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2009/03/19/omnicom-groups-bad-terms-for-photographers-and-producers/comment-page-1/#comment-40395</link>
		<dc:creator>andy anderson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 16:40:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.aphotoeditor.com/?p=2464#comment-40395</guid>
		<description>I received this request from a Omnicon agency in Detroit last week. This request is NOT limited to just photographers, but ALL vendors who might work with GM. 

My answer to my rep was a RESOUNDING......no. Its fundamentally wrong to fund anyone&#039;s photo shoots, especially large corporations. Do not over think it or try to rationalize it. It&#039;s WRONG and you should not ever do it. PERIOD!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I received this request from a Omnicon agency in Detroit last week. This request is NOT limited to just photographers, but ALL vendors who might work with GM. </p>
<p>My answer to my rep was a RESOUNDING&#8230;&#8230;no. Its fundamentally wrong to fund anyone&#8217;s photo shoots, especially large corporations. Do not over think it or try to rationalize it. It&#8217;s WRONG and you should not ever do it. PERIOD!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
