Comments on: Sir, We’re Not The Taco Stand

By: Steve Kownacki

Steve Kownacki — Wed, 01 Jul 2009 12:05:22 +0000

Sad but true, hear it all the time. A favorite line I read a while ago from potential client trying to negotiate lower rates on the phone – Caller: “So what do I get for 500 bucks?” Producer: “Heck, we’re almost there now.” THAT’S sticking to your guns. I’ve used this line and it’s actually a great ice-breaker to educate about rates and service. Thanks for the funny!

By: “I don’t piss without being paid.” Harian Ellison… | Ranga de Silva

“I don’t piss without being paid.” Harian Ellison… | Ranga de Silva — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 12:16:38 +0000

[...] got the link for the video from APhotoEditors’ blog post “Sir, Were Not the Taco Stand”. It has a cool clip about how clients want more for less. It’s worth taking a look; even if you [...]

By: ProPhotographer

ProPhotographer — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 10:12:07 +0000

I once refused to work pro-bono for a large UK charity on account of the fact that I’d seen it’s published accounts and the amount of charity money that was spent on:

The CEO
The rent of their buildings
Their advertising budget for press & TV

After a couple of emails the pic-ed said “That’s what I hate about photographers, they’re all capitalists”.

Unbelievable.

By: Peter Lorry

Peter Lorry — Sun, 07 Jun 2009 09:39:38 +0000

I’m still laughing

By: Peter Lorry

Peter Lorry — Sun, 07 Jun 2009 09:38:24 +0000

“We do not have rates for photographers as such. What we do offer is space in a beautifully produced magazine”

Sarah Fordham from Sublime Magazine dixit.

By: branko

branko — Sun, 07 Jun 2009 00:17:59 +0000

same shit all around the globe!
my new COO came out of nowhere and cut all.
can you imagine,in the magazine that is 90% photographs,he told me that my work has no economic value at all.
than next week circulation jump 10%,and He is a King.
i still have to shoot on same level,not because of him,but because of myself,and fatboy goes to boss office with small nubers and gets his bonus.ha ha!!

By: Bob

Bob — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 02:44:35 +0000

@Art Buyer,

Lol!

I’m looking forward to seeing microstock celebrated in One Show, Clio, and D&AD awards :D

It’s great if one project leads to another, but only if business is equitable. Very few advertising agencies would stay in business if they made no money – regardless of how much they love the job. Negotiation is a two way street. Often the visuals are the least expensive part of a campaign – yet also the cornerstone. Fair trade is a reasonable expectation.

By: Dave

Dave — Thu, 04 Jun 2009 19:01:22 +0000

Art buyer makes a very good point.
I laughed at the video and felt the pain just like everyone else. What the video didn’t show is all of us photographers saying “ok sure” right away and then whining about how we aren’t appreciated. The reality is that the market is over saturated with talented photographers fighting for less and less work. Clients know it’s a buyer’s market and they are acting accordingly. I think most of us want to think of ourselves as artists with a unique vision. However, in the commercial world, the truth is that we know there is a long line of photographers behind us that can provide acceptable work and are willing to work for any price.

By: Lance

Lance — Thu, 04 Jun 2009 13:43:33 +0000

wow i needed that. cheers.

By: Brett

Brett — Thu, 04 Jun 2009 05:36:50 +0000

@jimmy, That’s great!

By: Art Buyer

Art Buyer — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 16:21:23 +0000

@bcooter,
Your humor is appreciated, but your oath will be costing you jobs. The reality of the market right now is too obvious to ignore. My phone is ringing off the hook with reps and shooters needing work. Microstock, RF, photo school young guns, Flickr and in-house shooters all work against the photographer who is unwilling to negotiate.
I am in no way suggesting that you work for nothing or what you would consider unreasonable for a certain project, but often the value of a shoot is revealed in an award show pencil, the relationship built with an Art Director or a sweet portfolio piece. All of these things lead to other work.

By: dude

dude — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 13:25:30 +0000

This is so on point it’s painful.

By: bcooter

bcooter — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 06:51:01 +0000

The BCooter plan for economic recovery:

Every professional photographer in the world raise your right hand and repeat after me.

From this moment own, I _____you name______promise to quadruple every rate, fee and estimate I or my agents produce, compared to previous 2007 numbers.

I ______your name______promise when negotiations come to push to shove and the client asks me to re estimate the job at lower figures, I promise to go up another 25%. If the client asks for a third estimate, I promise to go up another 25% and so on and so on.

Signed ________________date______________space for blood oath____________.

This way there is no clawing your way back to prosperity.

By: Bill Hatcher

Bill Hatcher — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 04:54:04 +0000

Thanks for sharing this video. After watching this video I showed it to my student intern who begins art school in a couple of months. This video probably communicates more to her about valuing ones work and photography much more than hours of sitting through a business of photography class.

By: Mr. Sheldrake

Mr. Sheldrake — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 22:59:55 +0000

Welcome to my life.

Someone shoot me, please?

By: Michael T. Murphy

Michael T. Murphy — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 20:54:53 +0000

Thanks for sticking up for us Rob! Good to know ther is someone on our side. ;>)

By: Blue

Blue — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 18:50:50 +0000

So true especially in these sketchy financial times. I know a photographer who actually raised his rate. In doing so he actually started getting more high-end work with more control over his productions.
I also know a few people that schmooze and play the “I’ll totally hook you up” game, they have a great client list, but all the clients are one hit wonders.
If you want a Gucci shoot, you need to pay Gucci dollars.

By: ProPhotographer

ProPhotographer — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 18:40:35 +0000

“I sell my soul, but at the highest rates. I don’t piss without being paid.”

I so want this on my tombstone :)

By: RAEchel Running

RAEchel Running — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 18:21:20 +0000

Isn’t that nice??? maybe one can send this to those clients who don’t get it.
We often use the analogy of car rental-renting a car doesn’t mean you own the car – and the plumber….well he gets paid for his ’service’ every time….
thanks for the perspective- they should show this in photography class : )

By: Isaac Hernandez

Isaac Hernandez — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 18:08:15 +0000

Here’s the full segment on the Warner Brothers’ pirate thing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj5IV23g-fE

By: jimmy

jimmy — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 17:53:43 +0000

@j., Although -in tongue- some of us out there are just as bad.

http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/aus/558260167.html

By: Kevin Arnold

Kevin Arnold — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 17:50:01 +0000

Thanks, Rob. Love that first clip. Absolutely classic!

By: Steven Rood

Steven Rood — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 17:41:34 +0000

“We’re going to need you to show us how you did this, so we can do it ourselves, in-house from now on.”

Pretty much sums up too many projects to mention during my career in advertising. Now that I’m a photographer, I just say no. And it feels good.

Great post.

By: Laura Flippen

Laura Flippen — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 17:39:27 +0000

I love it!! Thanks for the levity Rob…

Just shot a job where they tried to rationalize smaller fees for potential work down the road when the client has a ‘real’ budget. Gotta stick to your guns!

By: brian faini

brian faini — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 16:57:45 +0000

“we are the guardians of forever”
I like his principles on being paid.

If your pipes are clogged or whatnot you call a plumber you don’t negotiate. You pay what they say.
They render a service and you pay the cost.

Many companies like to act like they are doing you a favor by hiring you and that you should replace payment with thankfulness.

I love what Harlan has to say in this bit
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj5IV23g-fE

By: JMG

JMG — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 16:19:35 +0000

I always worry about giving the pitch and then having them hire someone else to do it!

By: j.

j. — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 15:38:44 +0000

@jimmy,

haha! heard that one just the other day. To which I replied: “So if I do some work for free, you’re gonna find more free work for me? Sounds great…”

By: cynthia wood

cynthia wood — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 15:35:02 +0000

@Mason: Ha! That’s a good one. Unfortunately, it’s not an exaggeration of the truth… (The best comedy usually isn’t.)

By: Mason

Mason — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 15:09:10 +0000

I always loved this from Craigslist:
http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/hmb/1005451723.html

By: Darrell Eager

Darrell Eager — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 15:03:07 +0000

Dreams with Sharp Teeth, available @ Netflix.